What if you were fired for what you posted on your blog?
I just recently heard the story of a local student essentially being fired from his job because of a satiracle artilce he posted on his personal blog. I don't want to go into too many more details, because this person would rather have the whole situation just go away...but I thought it brought up an interesting point.
Should employers discipline or even terminate employees for what they post on the internet? What if it had nothing to do with their jobs? I've read articles recently where high school teachers were under fire for what their on-line profiles look like. NPR recently had a program about an Illinois school district patrolling MySpace profiles of students and busting them for pictures of them drinking or smoking.
Does your freedom extend to what you post? How about employers cyber-stalking their employees or potential hires? Is it Big Brother or just good business? I'm really interested to see what Provopulsers have to say on the matter. Thanks.
Company time
I've often thought about this myself... For your current job, I can only see it creating a problem if you are bloggin on company time. Other than that, I don't think they could get away with firing you for what you post (unless it's trade secrets or something along those lines).
But what concerns me is potential future employers that google your name, only to discover your blog and see what type of person you really are. This may not always be a problem, but if that potential employer takes offense or disagrees with anything you post, then who's to say they won't just move on to the next resume?
Keeping a blog can get you a job
I got hired at my current job in part because of my blog. If you document and keep track of the various projects or accomplishments that you perform on the job, then your blog becomes a sort of portfolio, and may be useful in getting a job.
On the other side of the table, I've also interviewed people, and I've often Googled their name. Of course the job was for a web developer and I felt that anyone who has enough experience as a web developer should be able to be Googled. Sometimes we see good things about someone, and sometimes not so good things, and they do effect our decisions.
I even had occasion once to interview with Mason, who I understand is the mastermind behind ProvoPulse. The moment I heard he ran this site, I decided to recommend him for the job. (He went to work for some other place).
My point is, though, that if you keep comments positive, a blog or website that you maintain can help you get certain jobs.
I am still so mad about this...
Ive actually been following the situation you mentioned and im still really mad about it. Your personal blog is that, personal. Yes you put it out there for others to read but unless you are doing something that actually negatively effects your employer then there is no reason for them to get involved.
This was a simple case of someone crying about being made fun of, and then using her political influence to force someone out of a job.
Not Private...
Blogs are not "Private" They are meant to be read... that is the whold idea behind posting them. When i said personal that was meant to illistrate that they contain "your" opinions and "your" ideas. I don't think there is anything wrong with checking up on a perspective future employee. Any additional information you have can help you make a better choice in selecting a future employee.
This was a situation where someone outside of the (employee-employer) circle saw something that she didn't like, and as a result pressure was put on the (employer) to fire the blogger. I agree that this person could have used an alias, or could have hidden his identity better. The question i ask is why should he have to? He wasn't hurting his employer, he wasn't blogging on company time. This seems like it is more of a question of freedom of speach then of privacy.
My $0.02
I think the thread is based in several subjects that do not fall in the same category. First of all, I think the case of being fired for what you put in your blog falls under a radically different category than high schools monitoring student blogs.
First:
This question is ambiguous and openended, there are too many different issues thrown in the same pot. Should employees be disciplined? Should students be disciplined? It depends.
-If they do it while on the clock, it's at the supervisor's discretion. If it is misuse of company resources (including time and money in the form of company wages), the employee is at fault
-If they do it while not on the clock, it depends on the nature of the stuff:
a)If the employee is giving away company secrets, well, that's illegal
b)If the conditions of employment include something about ethical standards that might be compromised while blogging on that specific subject, maybe they could rightfully get in trouble. Some places will require certain living standard even when not on the clock (working for BYU, some military forces, some churches, etc). This is OK, as long as the conditions of employment where clearly established when hiring the person. If you agreed upon it on writing when you were hired, it is not illegal or anti-freedom-of-speech to expect you to stick to your word.
c)If no clauses about personal standards were required when hiring the person, it depends on the nature of the blog. If it is inflamatory or insultive remarks about a coworker or a supervisor, that is fine, it's your freedom of speech (as long as something illegal such as libel or harrassment isn'ttaking place). Just keep in mind that most employment in private companies is at-will, so the supervisor or company might use their freedom to kick your trash out on the street. You keep your freedom of speech, they keep their freedom of offering employment.
d)If your comment were off the clock and not derogatory about the company or coworkers, you may have a case for discrimination (again, I repeat: you MAY have one).
Now, the situation with students at a public school may be different. While at school, the school is the de facto guardian of the student, and illegal activities on school premises may compromise the school itself. So yes, they should be free to take control of the students.
While not on school, the school isn't the guardian, so it is debatable. As long as the blogging isn't illegal or harrassing, you may have a case (again: you MAY have a case)
Freedom of speech never takes away responsibility from the person that makes a comment. And not all blogging or comments are under the protection of freedom of speech (e.g. libel, slander, threats, etc.)
1) Not everything you post is protected under the overstretched emblem of freedom
2) How about potential hires "cyber-stalking" a company by reading reviews, comments from other employees, etc.? Remember, a company is just as much of a "private party" as an individual.
The cyber-stalking argument is one that deserves further revision. Is googling someone's name stalking? NO, by a long shot. If there are non-password-protected things about you on the internet, it is not stalking, since the information is available to everyone in a legit manner.
This reminds me of a kid complaining that he felt his privacy was being jeopardized because his parents were checking what he was blogging about. This is cute, especially because this kid was whinning about privacy while posting in a public blog xD
Moral of the story: if you want privacy, don't look for it in MySpace, lol
"There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy." - Hamlet, Shakespeare
I don't think I made any
I wasn't trying to shoot them down, they were legitimate and good questions. I was just trying to explain how they covered many issues, and not only the MySpace issue you described. I hope you didn't take it as a personal attack, it wasn't intended to be one.
And regarding the wide range of issues covered on this topic, as I said it before, yes, things can come back and bite you. People are indeed responsible for what they write, and freedom of speech does not prevent you from that. I guess the issue is when people or organizations prescribe illegal disciplinary actions. And, as I said it before, not ALL disciplinary actions are out of place,. it depends in a lot of factors.
"There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy." - Hamlet, Shakespeare
Re: Keeping a blog can get you a job
So when these blogs have affected your decisions and were 'not so good things', what did they have? Things you disagreed with? Or something worse?
On my blog I talk about political and religious things that I think about day to day. So what happens when a future interviewer reads this, disagrees (so, is either a liberal or anti-Mormon), and pushes me aside?
Then again, perhaps I don't want to work in an environment where somebody harbors those feelings towards my attitudes and beliefs, so perhaps it is for the best?
Blogs are not personal
Your name is a public thing. I mean, if no one ever used my name, it wouldn't be meaningless and I might as well not even have one. Names are one way we associate information with an individual.
The moment you connect your name with a blog or other website, that website is no longer personal, it is public. If you want to keep your blog personal, don't use a public name with it; use an alias or something to remain anonymous.
I don't know the details about the mentioned situation. I've heard about a similar situation where someone didn't get a job because they complained about a former employer on their blog. As their future potential employer, I don't really want to hire someone who is more likely to publish negative comments about my company.
Not private, but not worth firing over
Having become a bit more privy to this situation, I am of the opinion that the woman responsible for the blogger's termination is irresponsible and out of line. The blogosphere is a public forum where people are free to post what they wish. At times, somebody might take offense or be the brunt of criticism or satire. So what? Forcing somebody to sanitize their message so that it's kosher with your thoughts and opinions is communism. You can disagree with somebody all you want, but that person still has every right under this free nation's founding precepts to post and say what they want.
No identity hiding is necessary. I don't do so on my blog, and when creating handles on other sites I don't do something like "tWn99Ek2xE" or anything obfuscated like that. I am who I am, my opinions are my own, and people are free to disagree with them. But I'm not going to hide behind my online identity to make myself more anonymous, thereby protecting me from direct rebuttals and responses.
It is a question of free speech, and the blogger had (and has) every right to post what he wants about this woman. Censoring your speech to the behest of another is communism and un-American.
pardon
This question is ambiguous and openended, there are too many different issues thrown in the same pot.
I don't think I made any arguements so I don't see why you are hell bent on shooting 'em down. My questions were openended because I wanted to drive discussion. I also thought I'd throw in lots of different examples of how what you write can come back to bite you.
I am interested in this subject and want to know what other bloggers and posters think about it.
Now, the situation with students at a public school may be different. While at school, the school is the de facto guardian of the student, and illegal activities on school premises may compromise the school itself. So yes, they should be free to take control of the students.
If you checked out the link you would see that these students were off-campus and the school used MySpace profiles to identify kids and then punish them.
Blogs to get jobs
Well, since we were interviewing a web developer, seeing a web page that was designed poorly quite easily negatively affected my decisions. I never really saw anything really bad, but if I found on someones blog or MySpace that they get drunk often, or cheat or lie, then I am less likely to see that person as someone I can count on in the workplace.
I would agree with you that anyone willing to not hire you because they disagree with your opinions on your blog is probably someone too pig-headed that you don't want to work for.
Exactly!
I'm always amazed that folks forget that the Internet is a very public place. I've come across quite a few blogs, by accident, and quite often the content is...interesting.
If I were a potential employer, I can't say I wouldn't use a blogger's content as a reason to deny employment. No one can say that,honestly. It all depends on the situation.
A prospective employer may not want to know that you got sloppy drunk last weekend, which resulted in you throwing up on your best friend's dog and making out with your best friend's significant other. That type of behavior exemplifies poor judgement  especially if you didn't have enough sense to create an alias and leave out personal identifying details.
So, yes, a prospective employer may pass you by, in search of someone who uses better judgement. We all gotta think, before we post. If you have to tell it all, use a plugin/add-on that allows specific posts to be password protected. Think, cuz if you don't, it'll cost you.
Great topic!
Well...
Just because you can say whatever you want, doesn't mean you should. That's the whole point. Most of us aren't able to sustain ourselves on the idea that "I did it my way", when poverty is close by, due to lack of employment.
Your steadfast position is admirable, but not necessarily practical. Unless you're in a position financially to deal with the consequences (including fighting for your so-called "rights") of losing your job, because of your public blog, it's best to take precautions.
Prudence is best
Nappy girl (interesting choice of a moniker),
I agree. It's not practical. I condone prudence and good jugement when putting things out there in the public sphere. However, you must be prepared (as you indicate) to face the consequences of your statements and actions.
If I'm going to use my free speech to scathe somebody, that doesn't mean I won't have to face the jury and deal with whatever consequences may some. Sure, I'm able to say what I want, and that's the great blessing of America. But nobody is protected or exempt from what will happen as a result of it.
Good points
Freedom of speech is important, but if used in an objectable manner, it does not exempt oneself from the logical consequences.
I think the medium of expression is irrelevant when passing moral judgements on freedom of speech issues. If you don't agree, well, there was no Internet back in the late 1700s, so you'd be implicitly saying freedom of speech doesn't protect electronic forms of comunication (other than Morse code, maybe?). With that concept in mind, we have this:
a)I think X (negative and/or irrespectful comments of a serious nature) about my boss Y. If I say X to Y on his/her face, is it unexpected/irrational/illegal/unethical of Y to fire me?
b)Now, let's say I don't have the balls to say X on Y's face, so I keep X on a low profile, just as a gossip at the workplace. If Y finds out I've being saying X behind his/her back, again, is it Disney to expect Y not to fire me?
c)Last (but not least), let's say I don't even have the balls to say X at work. So, I just simply post X on a blog. How can I say that Y shouldn't fire me, should he/she/ run into the above mentioned blog, if it is not illogical for Y to fire me in the above mentioned cases?
Moral of the story: NO! :)
"There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy." - Hamlet, Shakespeare
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